بحث با Marten and Inge: اشتباهات روزمره و سندرم لهجه خارجی

 
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Hi, in the previous video we
discussed the structure of the brain. Which parts of the brain are relevant for
language and what kinds of things can go wrong in the brain and
what cause do they have on our language. I'm now going to discuss these issues
further with my students Inge and Martin. >> So I have a question about
something that seems to go wrong, maybe in the brain. So what I've noticed is that I myself and many people around me make tiny errors,
more or less all the time. And, I was wondering if this is also
something that goes wrong with the brain? So, if this may be some sort
of mild aphasia or something? >> Okay good. These are very good observations,
both of them. First, that you observed that
you make these tiny mistakes, which many people don't
observe right away. So you're not really aware that you do but
you do make a lot of mistakes. You are not really aware because people
tend to forget immediately that such an error has occurred. But just now I made this,
a small mistake, right? So look back, go back a little bit in this video
you'll see I made a mistake there, okay. But you don't realize
because you correct for it immediately, and
this happens all the time. So that's a nice observation, and
it's also nice to make this connection, I think, to aphasia in
the sense that you might think, is this now a little kind of
tiny micro-aphasia problem? So it's just a very regional,
very small local problem in your brain which is also very temporal,
which lasts for very brief period. And that's why you make
just a little tiny mistake. Just a hesitation can
already be a tiny mistake. And I personally think that it is not
unlikely that those two things are indeed connected. What happens if you have aphasia,
well there is some part of your brain which you can not use anymore
because of the stroke that you had. Okay so
you have to find a way to work around it, maybe you don't find
a way to work around it. And in that case you have this problem. But your brain is, of course,
a very complex organ, so all the time there might be just tiny,
little problems, somewhere in your brain, which cause you to just not
find a word immediately, or just not make a sentence
which is completely grammatical. So all of these things can happen at
this very tiny and local level, indeed. >> Yeah. So one of the things that I
noticed is that, for example, there is these things called
tongue twisters, in Dutch. And I like them because
they're language games and one of them in Dutch has you
have to say the [FOREIGN]. So first you have a k sound then kr sound,
and what always seems to happen is
that you say you the [FOREIGN] so the kr seems to influence
the word that you say before it. >> Right. >> And
that seems to be like a planning thing. So your brain is sort of running ahead,
and then the words come behind and
they are used wrong. So, is that what always happens? That your future words
influence the words now. >> I see, okay,
this is an interesting question. So, again, I don't know what to say. You're making all this
great observations now. >> Thanks.
>> So, it's true, so you want to say cat, which means cat and then [FOREIGN],
which means scratch. But then, so instead of cat you say [FOREIGN] because the r is
basically influencing this sound there. >> Yeah. >> You can indeed think well this is
because while I'm saying cat, I'm trying to say that word, I'm already thinking
of the next word I have to say, because everything has to go so rapidly, so many
things basically happen at the same time. So pronouncing one word happens at the
same time as thinking already of the next words and that's, indeed, a very likely hypothesis about
why things happen in this way. Now, do they always go
in this direction only? No, not necessarily. So you can sometimes see the two
sounds really switch positions, so they move, one moves here, but the
other one moves there at the same time. So an example which is similar to
this one example you gave, and an example I like very much for some
reason, is that somebody tries to say, my dear queen, and
instead of that says, my queer dean. So what you do is the d of dear moves to the first position of queen and
becomes dean, and the qu inversely goes the other way
around, and dear becomes queer. >> Hm, okay. >> Okay, so now we've discussed
mistakes that can happen when you use your own language,
like your first language. But I can imagine that I would also make
mistakes if I used a second language like we use English now. >> Right.
>> But I was wondering would that be the same type of mistakes in the second
language, or would it be different? >> Yes, well obviously, I mean, the kind of mistakes we were just talking
about, there's no reason to think that you would not make those mistakes when
you speak a different language, right? So also when you speak a different
language, you're planning ahead. And actually a lot of these kinds of
problems find their origin in stress. So you're a bit stressed,
it's not extremely stress maybe but just a tiny little bit stressed and
therefore you grab for words as quickly as you can and
you just find a wrong word then. So, I would say you make those
kinds of mistakes just as well in a foreign language and
maybe even more so, more often. But obviously then there are also
mistakes which you just make because you have this other language,
you have your own native language, which is interfering, as we call it,
with the English you speak. >> Okay, so
in my case that could be because, I have Dutch as a native language. Dutch people find it difficult to say,
that, the th sound in English. That I could say, that,
because we do have the da sound. >> Right, yeah-
>> That type of interference. >> It's a good example. Actually, I think in this MOOC
you will hear me say that every once in awhile as well. So that's an example of
interference of my Dutch d, or the fact that I don't have
the in my native inventorial sounds on my English. So that's an influence indeed
of your native language on the foreign language we are speaking now,
which is English. And actually the influence
can go even further. So what I found very intriguing for
a long time is that if you take, is dat, if you take french and
Russian speakers, well french nor Russian has the,
but both French and Russian have d and z. But French speakers when they try
to say that, they tend to say zat. And Russian speakers,
when they try to say, that, they say dat. So, there is some kind of influence
of your native language, even there. Even though you have several
options at your disposition, you're going to go to one of them. And that's probably also influenced
by your native language. >> I was also reminded of this video
clip I saw a few weeks ago and it showed a lady who was
a native speaker of English. One day she woke up and
she suddenly spoke Chinese. >> [LAUGH] Yes. >> And I thought, is this possible? In the video clip it was called
the Foreign Accent Syndrome. >> Yeah, okay. I'm laughing because this is wrong in so
many different ways. >> [LAUGH]
>> So first is it possible that you are a native
speaker of English let's say, and you wake up one morning and all of a
sudden you discover that you speak Chinese fluently even though you never even taken
a course or your parents were not Chinese, you've never met a Chinese person but
now you speak Chinese fluently. It's a story you'll hear sometimes so
this is not the only case, so it is known. Sometimes in the press you
find examples of this. Let's say it is possible in theory,
but it's extremely unlikely, it's possible in the sense that it is
possible that you have the egg shells and the broken egg and you throw it on the
floor, all of a sudden it becomes a whole egg again, that is possible physically,
but it's not very likely. And this is the same kind of thing. So what could happen is
that you have some kind of hurricane in your brain which changes
every single neuron in your brain so that now all of the sudden they are set
in such a way which is similar to that of somebody who has learnt
Chinese as a child, right? So learning a language probably means you
had set all kinds of neurons in your head in a certain way, and then you
speak that language in certain way. While that could happen by accident,
but it's very unlikely. You notice there's also some
people talk about a pill. So you could take a pill which
would teach you a language. So you can take a Chinese language pill. You take it and it changes your
brain in such a way that now, Chinese is also part of your brain. That's maybe slightly more likely because
it's technology so maybe people can do it. But I'm afraid we're not going to live
to the day that that pill is going to be invented. But there's another part to the story. This is the foreign accent syndrome story. That term is basically wrong in this
case because the woman woke up and she spoke Chinese. So she spoke really a different language. Foreign accent syndrome usually applies
to cases where somebody wakes up and speaks their own language but
now with a foreign accent. So the woman would have woke up,
English speaking woman wakes up and speaks English with a Chinese accent. Is that possible? Well, it's slightly more likely let's say, because certain things could happen but it's still extremely unlikely that it's
exactly the same as a Chinese accent. It would still require having to reset
all this kinds of neurons in your head. What can happen of course is somebody
wakes up, has had maybe a little stroke and therefore some of
her sounds are affected. She can no longer say the even though
she's a native speaker of English, she can no longer say the and she says za instead
just like a French person would do. So that's possible. And then, maybe some people
around her may listen to her and think, yes, okay,
to me that sounds very Chinese. And then say, okay,
you have a Chinese accent syndrome. >> So, what happens really is that some
sound changes that we really associate with the accent in the other language. >> Exactly. So that my neighbors they're all have
been to France on holiday and now they hear me say zat and then they think
that's must be from really French accent. >> Yes.
>> Bit funny so it must be kind of a French accent. Okay, well I guess this
concludes our discussion. And I invite you to come
over to the next video, in which we are going to
discuss one specific topic. We are going to discuss how
reading works in the brain.

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